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Old 08-29-2011, 09:05 PM    (permalink
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This cut is about performance and more than a few players got very lazy under Bum Phillips kid.

What I have seen is JG going back in time to JJ and BP -- Vets need to not only be better but they need to be MUCH better or be just as cheap.

The guys cut were all over-rated and there are still a few left that need to be cut .... under Camp Cupcake were he was worried about Jones' opinion these guys simply got old.

Guys, Gurode, in 2007 broke down in the GMen game. He could not deal with the pressure of the line calls. Flo and Colombo broke down in the 2009 playoffs versus Minnesota after going in the "hot" team. For all the flack Kosier got about not being able to man up Kris Jenkins or Shaun Rogers the line always played much better with him b/c of his brains and the fact he was in the right place at the right time. 90% of OL play is being on your assignment if only to stand in front of him -- you don't need road-graters when you have great offensive personnel.

So, count me as one EXCITED to see the team FINALLY stop investing in Vets who always disappoint and starting to invest in younger guys. If the Coaches are right -- by the end of the year the line will be very good and very young. Too bad we burned through some youg, talented players under Bum's reign who might be starters right now.

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Old 08-29-2011, 09:07 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by M.O.T.H. View Post
That loser, JJT, has said as much. No team goes into a season with three inexperienced lineman with a contending mentality, or championship aspirations. It's a move that screams re-build. It's also the first Cowboy team in team history that will start the season with two rookies starting along the line.
JJT is football ignorant. His opinions are always formulaic and lack substance. Archer is the bet columnist there IMHO.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:07 PM    (permalink
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JJT is football ignorant. His opinions are always formulaic and lack substance. Archer is the bet columnist there IMHO.
I hate both...JJT is one smug bastard, though.

JJT is right in this regard, however. Our line and playoff aspirations dont add up. At least, I can say that before they see the field. But chances are, it will take a while for them to gel, if they do at all.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:10 PM    (permalink
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I bought 2008 Madden, and hated it. It was a rush job and is terrible. I haven't bought Madden since. I loved the 06 one with McNabb on the cover. I had that for regular xbox and NCAA 06. I used to export the draft class to the Madden Best game ever. But my xbox ruined madden, so now I gotta go hunting for Madden 06.

I am skeptical of this madden, especially with their hype and marketing.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:13 PM    (permalink
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I def. preferred playing Madden during the PS2/XBox era. I was more partial to the PS2 one, myself. And god, the best one ever is the one with the expansion mode. The Texans first year, it was amazing. You started things off with an expansion draft, either with the Texans or a created team. Real expansion draft rules and what not, so much fun. They really should add an expansion mode to today's Madden, just for the hell of it and the fun of it. They'd just have to figure out the scheduling.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:15 PM    (permalink
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The Vick one where you can create your own playbook was amazing! At least they finally added that feature to this year's madden. But I'd not a fan of the newer ones. But I will read people's reviews tomorrow. I hope the scouting feature isn't as bad.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:19 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I hear you....Madden actually had some interesting features, or more like, experiments back then. I loved the vision cone. But the leading receivers thing was so cheap. Where you could just break the receiver off of his route at any point. That had to be the easiest Madden ever. It was like backyard football. Impossible to cover in that game against users.

They were fun, though. I remember simming a season with David Boston at RB and he ran for like 3000 yards and I loved putting fat guys at skill positions, just for the hell of it. Larry Allen running QB sneaks. Good stuff.

Sadly, I'm all about realism now with my sports games and Madden doesnt really do it for me.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:23 PM    (permalink
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Since I love the Xs and Os, I could spend forever creating the playbook on both sides of the ball, specifically offense though. Madden 09 anniversary edition came with NFL Head Coach 09. That was my perfect game! I usually play madden for the franchise mode, and simulate it. But this was perfect! You manage everything and call the play and they execute it. Just a great game. One would think they can add NFL HC to the franchise mode portion and bump the review grade from 8ish to high 9 or even 10.

If GTA Liberty city and Elder Scrolls, and Halo can get near perfect ratings, then why can't Madden? Makes you wonder...
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:27 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by yanksknicks View Post
This cut is about performance and more than a few players got very lazy under Bum Phillips kid.

What I have seen is JG going back in time to JJ and BP -- Vets need to not only be better but they need to be MUCH better or be just as cheap.

The guys cut were all over-rated and there are still a few left that need to be cut .... under Camp Cupcake were he was worried about Jones' opinion these guys simply got old.

Guys, Gurode, in 2007 broke down in the GMen game. He could not deal with the pressure of the line calls. Flo and Colombo broke down in the 2009 playoffs versus Minnesota after going in the "hot" team. For all the flack Kosier got about not being able to man up Kris Jenkins or Shaun Rogers the line always played much better with him b/c of his brains and the fact he was in the right place at the right time. 90% of OL play is being on your assignment if only to stand in front of him -- you don't need road-graters when you have great offensive personnel.

So, count me as one EXCITED to see the team FINALLY stop investing in Vets who always disappoint and starting to invest in younger guys. If the Coaches are right -- by the end of the year the line will be very good and very young. Too bad we burned through some youg, talented players under Bum's reign who might be starters right now.
I'd got excited but then I remembered we gave Marcus Spears $20 Million and gave Scandrick money that he's supposed to earn, but hasn't up to this point. So much for paying based off play, huh? We'll be in the same boat down the line. The cuts aren't new. We've always made tough cuts and resigned our guys for too much. Miles Austin's deal is a joke now.

Now look at the Eagles... Cullen Jenkins who is 10 times better than Spears got $25M, but could be cut after a 1 year, $4M. Low risk rental. Brilliant move.

Let's start looking at the entire picture folks.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:30 PM    (permalink
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It'd be nice if EA didnt corner the market. I'd love to see others take a stab with the NFL license.

As for HC...I just couldnt get into it. I love the idea, but the actual sim itself is kind of broken. The players are all morons and the play calling you see against your opposition could be wonky. I'm a big sim guy myself...but the AI is always total crap, when you can coach em and watch em, imo. I normally stick with just franchise mode in games. But of course, there are always inconsistencies here as well. A big one for me, is that 34 OLB never seem to rush the passer when you sim at all. Regardless of your schematics or settings. I still have tons of simming, however. Madden, NBA 2K, NCAA, MLB the Show...you name it. haha. I have so many franchise/dynasties just simming and playing coach/GM. I love it.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:39 PM    (permalink
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I am sure EA can make that Head Coach element better and implement it into franchise mode. Maybe they keep adjustment and modifications short so that year by year they can add stuff. But what bothers me is that the rating still stays the same, between 7.9 -8.5 ish. Can't a huge EA sports company get their cash cow into the high 9s or 10s? Is that so hard for 1 year make the best game possible?

I love simulating madden, or play the first 5 games, and get insane stats,and then sim it. Because madden tends to screw me even if I have the best team. By preseason I have 1000 guys on IR. Damn cheaters!
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:47 PM    (permalink
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lol. It's kind of lame...but I almost always sim with injuries off. The injuries just tend to be way over done in video games.

As for game additions...EA always leaves things out on purpose so they can make subtle improvements each year. Really they should be trying to make the best game possible...but whatever. It's not like people would stop buying the game if it was perfected and the same game every year, with new rosters. Because right now, the game is already the same game every year. But it's of subpar quality and these "subtle improvements" dont enhance much from year to year. haha. People are going to buy the damn thing regardless of quality. They should just kill it one year...absolutely re-haul it and make it chalk full of new and deep features. They kind of owe it to the fans. Seems like they've been stealing their money for years.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:52 PM    (permalink
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I am sure EA can make that Head Coach element better and implement it into franchise mode.
I've been saying this for years now, it makes all the sense in the world too which means it'll never happen. No reason for EA to work hard to make a great game when their is no competition. But they'll be some weird random new thing this year like customizing end zone dances or something stupid.
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Old 08-29-2011, 09:59 PM    (permalink
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I've been saying this for years now, it makes all the sense in the world too which means it'll never happen. No reason for EA to work hard to make a great game when their is no competition. But they'll be some weird random new thing this year like customizing end zone dances or something stupid.
Exactly! I don't care about celebrations or that stuff! Everytime I see that in the commercials it makes me shake my head. Like the superbowl has a fly over by fighter jets. Is that really needed?! It's like putting make up on an ugly chick and trying to tell me she is hot!

Fix the game right! At least make it once and get it to a 10 to show me you can. And they have a monopoly on the game, and they are amazing at PR and marketing getting pro players in it and give their opinions.

Also, look how they marketed the game at Bryant park.. Madden Pro AM. Celebrities and hall of famers and such. All people got a free game! Amazing marketing. After you do that, I guess you can put out an avg to above avg game and keep riding it out.
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Old 08-29-2011, 10:40 PM    (permalink
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I'd got excited but then I remembered we gave Marcus Spears $20 Million and gave Scandrick money that he's supposed to earn, but hasn't up to this point. So much for paying based off play, huh? We'll be in the same boat down the line. The cuts aren't new. We've always made tough cuts and resigned our guys for too much. Miles Austin's deal is a joke now.

Now look at the Eagles... Cullen Jenkins who is 10 times better than Spears got $25M, but could be cut after a 1 year, $4M. Low risk rental. Brilliant move.

Let's start looking at the entire picture folks.
this.

It's not even like we've followed through on this new philosophy of paying guys that earn it. Spears has been an underachiever since he got here and scandrick has been extremely inconsistent. We signed both of them to huge extensions that they didn't deserve.

We did a poor job of preparing for this oline overhaul. Sure Nagy and costa could wind up being miracles for us but the chances of that happening are extremely small. I question the organizations thought process on this whole thing, asking 3 inexperienced guys to start seems more like a desperation ploy than anything else.

I hope I'm wrong, but this looks like it's going to blow up in our face.
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Old 08-30-2011, 08:21 AM    (permalink
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I'd got excited but then I remembered we gave Marcus Spears $20 Million and gave Scandrick money that he's supposed to earn, but hasn't up to this point. So much for paying based off play, huh? We'll be in the same boat down the line. The cuts aren't new. We've always made tough cuts and resigned our guys for too much. Miles Austin's deal is a joke now.

Now look at the Eagles... Cullen Jenkins who is 10 times better than Spears got $25M, but could be cut after a 1 year, $4M. Low risk rental. Brilliant move.

Let's start looking at the entire picture folks.
Not sure I completely agree but hey...
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Old 08-30-2011, 08:53 AM    (permalink
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I agree with all of those bolded statements. So why are you upset with me again? I'm saying the same thing.
Because you're painting anyone that's not upset about the move as kool aid drinking fanboys. When that's not the case. I think most posters here are reasonable and level headed and realize that the expectations for the team will depend on how this young Oline will play, and how the Defense that was the worst in franchise history last year will take to Ryan's scheme.

We're saying the same things..but have two different outlooks. Neither is wrong.
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Old 08-30-2011, 09:35 AM    (permalink
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Anyone buying Madden for 360? If so, I'd like to hear your review of it. Thanks!
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Old 08-30-2011, 09:44 AM    (permalink
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Here's the thing that I think some are missing. While I agree our young guys are going to take their lumps, the opposing point seems to be that the errors were non existant for the veterans.

The reality was that even though they were veterans, they couldn't move and because of that, Garrett's playbook was very limited. With these young kids, the playbook is wide open now. I think the added flexibility can negate the diff in experience.

So bottom line, while I agree there will be some lumps due to youth, the positives with regards to what Garrett can now do with the gameplan means that big picture, the team could actually be better.

As to the defense, while everyone focuses on the fact that they were so bad last year, and they were, the also seem to forget that 2 years ago they were the #2 defense in the league with virtually the same personnel. While I don't think they are that good, I think they are more than capable of being a middle of the pack defense. With a good offense and a middle of the pack defense, I think we can compete for this division title.
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Old 08-30-2011, 09:52 AM    (permalink
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Although it is VERY disappointing that Jerry can never find a trade partner. I'm not upset with the getting rid of Gurode, that's what teams like the Pats/Eagles/Steelers do....but those teams always seem to flip players for picks.

I'm reading that there's 6 teams that are interested in Gurode, and there's no doubt his Salary had something to do with him being traded, but Jerry couldn't find just ONE team to give up a 6th? *shaking my head*
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Old 08-30-2011, 09:58 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Macarthur View Post
Here's the thing that I think some are missing. While I agree our young guys are going to take their lumps, the opposing point seems to be that the errors were non existant for the veterans.

The reality was that even though they were veterans, they couldn't move and because of that, Garrett's playbook was very limited. With these young kids, the playbook is wide open now. I think the added flexibility can negate the diff in experience.

So bottom line, while I agree there will be some lumps due to youth, the positives with regards to what Garrett can now do with the gameplan means that big picture, the team could actually be better.

As to the defense, while everyone focuses on the fact that they were so bad last year, and they were, the also seem to forget that 2 years ago they were the #2 defense in the league with virtually the same personnel. While I don't think they are that good, I think they are more than capable of being a middle of the pack defense. With a good offense and a middle of the pack defense, I think we can compete for this division title.
Good post. I agree on the assessment of the OL. I feel that these guys fit JG's scheme a lot more than the old guys. We need slightly smaller, more agile players. There will be some lumps, but I feel that can be overcome.

The defense is still a mystery to me. I'm hoping we can cure some of the secondary issues with a better pass rush this year. Pressure is on Spencer and if Butler can live up to the pre-season hype we could be in good shape. I agree that we can be a middle of the pack defense.
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Old 08-30-2011, 09:58 AM    (permalink
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MOTH,

Check the review out.. 7.5 for gamespot for Madden. Come on! Seems like the game is progressively getting worse! But hey, at least I can see TD celebrations!

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox360/spor...%3Bread-review
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Old 08-30-2011, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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Because you're painting anyone that's not upset about the move as kool aid drinking fanboys. When that's not the case. I think most posters here are reasonable and level headed and realize that the expectations for the team will depend on how this young Oline will play, and how the Defense that was the worst in franchise history last year will take to Ryan's scheme.

We're saying the same things..but have two different outlooks. Neither is wrong.
That's not even accurate. I keep saying this, but it's not sinking in, so this is the last time I will say it before I give up. I am NOT upset with the cuts we have made. As for the OL...what I'm upset with is the lack of a better plan/strategy/philosophy.... the way they are relying on youth to step up right away. I don't think this was "the plan" going into the offseason. I don't think they prepared themselves for this. Rather, I think they saw something in Costa in practice/preaseason and decided to make an "on the fly" decision to cut Gurode... "on the fly" decision to move Kosier... "on the fly" decision to start Nagy. It's just the way this team went about rebuilding the OL. I think it's incredibly risky to do. I would've liked to see a better investment in FA, even adding "stop gap" type players like Kruetz.

I don't even know if I trust them in all their raving and praising of their young OL. I get a feeling Jerry missed the boat in FA and is now trying to sell the idea that what he found are hidden gems. Color me skeptical. Last season Sam Young was in this boat... and I never bought it last year, though I know more than a few here drank that kool aid.

I just gotta go back to their PLAN to revamp the line. They should've known Gurode was a candidate to be cut. Rather than placing all their eggs in Costa's basket, why not cover your ass and spread the risk? They could've used the draft and FA much better if they had been better prepared. Why do we have Bill Nagy as our starting LG? That's insane to me. Sorry, it is. So much for having high hopes on FA Guards like Davin Joseph, Blalock, Dahl...heck, even Colledge and Gallery provide less risk.

Now, I do have confidence that there is something budding with this group of young lineman, but I would've much rather preferred to put them on a development track. I admit, my skepticism could entirely be all for naught. If this 3 hat trick works to the point where our offense can move the ball and protect Romo, then I'll definitely be pleased with adequacy. They don't have to be dominant. Just mistake free and as effective as possible, and I think that is a possibility. Here's hoping this plan of Jerry's works. That's all I can say.
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Old 08-30-2011, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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Here's the thing that I think some are missing. While I agree our young guys are going to take their lumps, the opposing point seems to be that the errors were non existant for the veterans.

The reality was that even though they were veterans, they couldn't move and because of that, Garrett's playbook was very limited. With these young kids, the playbook is wide open now. I think the added flexibility can negate the diff in experience.

So bottom line, while I agree there will be some lumps due to youth, the positives with regards to what Garrett can now do with the gameplan means that big picture, the team could actually be better.

As to the defense, while everyone focuses on the fact that they were so bad last year, and they were, the also seem to forget that 2 years ago they were the #2 defense in the league with virtually the same personnel. While I don't think they are that good, I think they are more than capable of being a middle of the pack defense. With a good offense and a middle of the pack defense, I think we can compete for this division title.
Yeah, that's a good point about them being more mobile. I would've preferred to minimize the risk. We could've gotten guys that fit that weren't as inexperienced. Daryn Colledge would've been a perfect example.

The defense is going to have a steep learning curve. I just hope Rob can infuse a new attitude here and get the guys motivated to play above their talent level. I'm most curious to see which of our secondary guys he will be sending on DB blitzes cause that's a big part of his defensive playcalling and I don't know if we have those kind of guys.
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Old 08-30-2011, 01:28 PM    (permalink
Macarthur
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I don't even know if I trust them in all their raving and praising of their young OL. I get a feeling Jerry missed the boat in FA and is now trying to sell the idea that what he found are hidden gems. Color me skeptical. Last season Sam Young was in this boat... and I never bought it last year, though I know more than a few here drank that kool aid.
I would agree if this were all about Jerry. I really listen to very little of what Jerry says. I trust that Garrett isn't going to sugar coat things.

I also put stock in what Broaddus says and he seems to thing these kids can play.
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