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Old 11-14-2011, 06:23 PM    (permalink
CDCB14
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"Kid is a baller"... don't make me laugh.

Robinson is a good #3 receiver or fill in starter. He showed some nice deep threat ability yesterday, and has shown good hands so far. ...but his YAC ability leaves a lot to be desired. Asking him to make something out of nothing is not his forte.
He just caught a 60 yard TD on a pretty decent CB who he made look like a high schooler. You thought the signing was bad and thought he brought nothing better than holley or ogletree..

Haha, please. I'll let his production speak for my side of the argument, the correct side.
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Old 11-14-2011, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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He just caught a 60 yard TD on a pretty decent CB who he made look like a high schooler. You thought the signing was bad and thought he brought nothing better than holley or ogletree..

Haha, please. I'll let his production speak for my side of the argument, the correct side.
So what, that TD makes you think he has YAC ability???

True, I didn't think much of him and he has seized his opportunity and made me change my mind about wanting to extend him. He seems like a keeper and asset to the team.

So add him to the long list of wrongs that I've been on about. You act like he's god's gift to football and that you deserve some kind of internet award for liking the signing in the first place. Get off your high horse. People are right here a lot of times, but I don't hear anyone seeking praise like you do. Not even Bob. lol.

...and correct that about Ogletree. I never said anything about him. He's garbage.

Last edited by D-Unit : 11-14-2011 at 07:17 PM.
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Old 11-14-2011, 08:10 PM    (permalink
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@D-Unit: Can't have it both ways >.< :D Garrett praises Romo and the interior oline but he doesn't trust Romo while trusting the oline? Complicated. Garrett has gone out of his way to point out Romo is a top 10 QB in the league not something you normally do if you don't have the utmost of trust. Most outlets say that Romo's most staunch supporter is Garrett as well.

--------

I love Robinson as much as the next guy and was extremely happy with the signing but cmon CDC don't play him up as something he isn't. He is not a guy who is going to overwhelm you with physicality, or make multiple guys miss and get the coveted high YAC averages. He's a solid route runner with great hands. Meaning he's the perfect fit for our offense and for Romo. Using that route as evidence of him 'being a baller' is as awful as using Holley's 'almost' TD against the Niners in OT. Blown coverage is an indictment of the defense NOT a praise of the offense.

Last but not least... Victor Butler is a solid pass rusher but he is overaggressive and gets completely tooled on running plays. Case in point. Run up the middle against Buffalo should have been stopped in the backfield if Butler keeps his position and seals the edge. Instead he ran inside and allows a clear cutback lane and a large scamper for the Bills. He's done it multiple times along with allowing blockers to 'guide' him out of position as he takes the easiest route up the field rather than reading the 'fake block' and holding position. Ware is a GREAT example of reading the run and getting in the lane. If we cut 'Almost Anthony' we have to draft someone high, sign a FA etc unless they see a massive uptick in the run stopping prowess of Butler.

I'm all aboard the lineman clogging NT train though :)
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Old 11-14-2011, 08:54 PM    (permalink
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@D-Unit: Can't have it both ways >.< :D Garrett praises Romo and the interior oline but he doesn't trust Romo while trusting the oline? Complicated. Garrett has gone out of his way to point out Romo is a top 10 QB in the league not something you normally do if you don't have the utmost of trust. Most outlets say that Romo's most staunch supporter is Garrett as well.

--------

I love Robinson as much as the next guy and was extremely happy with the signing but cmon CDC don't play him up as something he isn't. He is not a guy who is going to overwhelm you with physicality, or make multiple guys miss and get the coveted high YAC averages. He's a solid route runner with great hands. Meaning he's the perfect fit for our offense and for Romo. Using that route as evidence of him 'being a baller' is as awful as using Holley's 'almost' TD against the Niners in OT. Blown coverage is an indictment of the defense NOT a praise of the offense.

Last but not least... Victor Butler is a solid pass rusher but he is overaggressive and gets completely tooled on running plays. Case in point. Run up the middle against Buffalo should have been stopped in the backfield if Butler keeps his position and seals the edge. Instead he ran inside and allows a clear cutback lane and a large scamper for the Bills. He's done it multiple times along with allowing blockers to 'guide' him out of position as he takes the easiest route up the field rather than reading the 'fake block' and holding position. Ware is a GREAT example of reading the run and getting in the lane. If we cut 'Almost Anthony' we have to draft someone high, sign a FA etc unless they see a massive uptick in the run stopping prowess of Butler.

I'm all aboard the lineman clogging NT train though :)
I getcha... I getcha... but I'm not reading into his words as much as I am reading into his actions.

The thing I can't ignore is how we plan to transition our team from having one franchise QB to another.

The smoothest way is to develop a QB with real potential, and not wait until it's too late and then have to suffer through a bad season before we can draft one, and then hope he doesn't bust or best case scenario, endure multiple seasons of development.

I think we've been trying it with McGee, but I think he's a career backup at best. I want a real QB who we can groom ala the Aaron Rodgers route. I don't want to be like Indy and Miami this year, having to suck. I don't want to be like Cincy or Carolina, having to live through QB growing pains. I want as smooth a transition as possible, and there are several reasons why I think this year is the best time to do it.

1) I don't think our needs are plentiful. We're as flexible as we'll ever be as far as where to spend our 1st round pick.

2) I think quality QBs will fall in the draft. Unlike last year when teams reached for substandard talent due to need, I think this year, the opposite will happen. Good QBs will fall, due to the need not being as strong.

3) I think the timing is good now to develop a QB BEORE Romo is completely washed up. Having 2-3 years to learn Garrett's system, learn the nuances of the NFL and learn behind Romo is a great path to success.

4) It provides Romo with a legitimate reason to maintain his edge and not get complacent in thinking his job is secure and he can continue to make mistakes without worry of what will happen.

5) Grabbing a future franchise QB is a great thing for a Head Coach in his 2nd year in increasing his long term stability odds.

6) It's also a great thing for a developing QB who won't have to learn a new system wondering in the back of his mind if his HC will still be there next year or not. Since Garrett's position is safe, that reason is eliminated.

7) A QB who develops through the system will more naturally earn the respect of his team (if he develops right) when they have seen him grow in practices, compared to a new rookie who is new to the team and the league.

8) Tony Romo's contract is over in 2013. That's right around the corner.
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Old 11-14-2011, 10:38 PM    (permalink
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So what, that TD makes you think he has YAC ability???

True, I didn't think much of him and he has seized his opportunity and made me change my mind about wanting to extend him. He seems like a keeper and asset to the team.

So add him to the long list of wrongs that I've been on about. You act like he's god's gift to football and that you deserve some kind of internet award for liking the signing in the first place. Get off your high horse. People are right here a lot of times, but I don't hear anyone seeking praise like you do. Not even Bob. lol.

...and correct that about Ogletree. I never said anything about him. He's garbage.
Seeking "internet cred" is not what I wanted at all, I was more or less joking around, but ok.

As for this week, I do think this could be a trap game just because it's a divisional game, and washington is that bad, but with the ineptitude of their offense there is no reason we should lose this game.
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Old 11-15-2011, 08:55 AM    (permalink
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1) I don't think our needs are plentiful. We're as flexible as we'll ever be as far as where to spend our 1st round pick.

2) I think quality QBs will fall in the draft. Unlike last year when teams reached for substandard talent due to need, I think this year, the opposite will happen. Good QBs will fall, due to the need not being as strong.

3) I think the timing is good now to develop a QB BEORE Romo is completely washed up. Having 2-3 years to learn Garrett's system, learn the nuances of the NFL and learn behind Romo is a great path to success.

4) It provides Romo with a legitimate reason to maintain his edge and not get complacent in thinking his job is secure and he can continue to make mistakes without worry of what will happen.

5) Grabbing a future franchise QB is a great thing for a Head Coach in his 2nd year in increasing his long term stability odds.

6) It's also a great thing for a developing QB who won't have to learn a new system wondering in the back of his mind if his HC will still be there next year or not. Since Garrett's position is safe, that reason is eliminated.

7) A QB who develops through the system will more naturally earn the respect of his team (if he develops right) when they have seen him grow in practices, compared to a new rookie who is new to the team and the league.

8) Tony Romo's contract is over in 2013. That's right around the corner.
1) So... The S's, 3rd CB, NT, Interior Line are all needs which should be addressed before a first round backup QB.

3) Completely washed up??? Are you ******* kidding me?

4) Oh **** off with this legitimate edge crap. Kitna was supposed to provide that. It's horseshit. Having a quality backup isn't going to effect Romo's game for the better or worse. You know what will... *shock horror* better playcalling.

5) I will not deny that. It's also fantastic tradebait as Andy Reid have found out over the last few years. But having a backup to Romo now for 4-6 years down the track(cause that's how long we should be expecting him to play at a competitive level) is silly. May as well just keep McGee and have him train up the new guy 4 years down the track.

6) It is a great point but it's completely meaningless when you acknowledge the true lack of need in drafting a QB that high.

7) By the time he gets in the starting lineup. 3/4 of the team won't be there anyway with the current turnover of NFL rosters.

8) Tony Romo's contract WILL be reupped. Bank on that.


The most important thing to consider is that Romo is a long way off having a significant drop in talent. I do agree with the notion of drafting a QB before he is actually physically retired. But there is no way that date is anytime soon and we would probably have a situation where we are drafting a QB for tradebait or because this franchise is ran so poorly at times. The player would probably be cut at the end of his rookie contract and catch on elsewhere.

If and I stress IF... If a QB is atop our draft board when picking then... We should take him as I think BPA should probably be the way we go when the draft comes around. But I wouldn't be taking a QB before say a TE if a TE was #1 and a QB was #2 on the board at our selection.(this point is made to show another position of strength would still see me choose BPA against a QB)

P.S to CDCB14... I fail to see how this team has anything on it's schedule that should be referred to as a trap game. We have hardly played this season with any form of consistency or strength to think ANY game on the schedule is a given. This team is all about "Every game as it comes".
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:45 AM    (permalink
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I completely forgot about Victor Butler! Yeah, that pushes OLB down on the needs list, even if we lost Spencer. Butler has been quiet this year... but going into the season, I was pumping him up that he should start over Spencer. If I think about it... I think I still feel the same today.

Depth would be good, but that can come cheap.
I think you can never have enough LB's. It's like CB's and DL, never enough of them.
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:01 PM    (permalink
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1) So... The S's, 3rd CB, NT, Interior Line are all needs which should be addressed before a first round backup QB.

3) Completely washed up??? Are you ******* kidding me?

4) Oh **** off with this legitimate edge crap. Kitna was supposed to provide that. It's horseshit. Having a quality backup isn't going to effect Romo's game for the better or worse. You know what will... *shock horror* better playcalling.

5) I will not deny that. It's also fantastic tradebait as Andy Reid have found out over the last few years. But having a backup to Romo now for 4-6 years down the track(cause that's how long we should be expecting him to play at a competitive level) is silly. May as well just keep McGee and have him train up the new guy 4 years down the track.

6) It is a great point but it's completely meaningless when you acknowledge the true lack of need in drafting a QB that high.

7) By the time he gets in the starting lineup. 3/4 of the team won't be there anyway with the current turnover of NFL rosters.

8) Tony Romo's contract WILL be reupped. Bank on that.


The most important thing to consider is that Romo is a long way off having a significant drop in talent. I do agree with the notion of drafting a QB before he is actually physically retired. But there is no way that date is anytime soon and we would probably have a situation where we are drafting a QB for tradebait or because this franchise is ran so poorly at times. The player would probably be cut at the end of his rookie contract and catch on elsewhere.

If and I stress IF... If a QB is atop our draft board when picking then... We should take him as I think BPA should probably be the way we go when the draft comes around. But I wouldn't be taking a QB before say a TE if a TE was #1 and a QB was #2 on the board at our selection.(this point is made to show another position of strength would still see me choose BPA against a QB)

P.S to CDCB14... I fail to see how this team has anything on it's schedule that should be referred to as a trap game. We have hardly played this season with any form of consistency or strength to think ANY game on the schedule is a given. This team is all about "Every game as it comes".
I agree with pretty much everything you said.

As for it not being possible to have a trap game for this team because of the way they play, I would agree with you, but with how bad washington is it should be a given, but with them you never know. I am a bit nervous.
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:18 PM    (permalink
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No surprise here, but Jerry indicating that Felix is returning as the backup.

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/story/...demarco-murray
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:22 PM    (permalink
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What kind of Trade Value do you think we have with Felix this upcoming offseason?
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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I'd be surprised if we could get anything more than a third round pick for him, at which point i'd rather him stay on the team. He's more valuable to us as a gadget guy, along with him helping on kick and punt returns, than a third rounder. Given his injury history and his inability to produce with a high workload, i doubt any team would want to sacrifice more than that.
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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No surprise here, but Jerry indicating that Felix is returning as the backup.

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/story/...demarco-murray
Nice to see Jerry has the balls to make this decision. I'm not sure Garrett would have.

Paul, as for trade value, I'd rather keep him for the same reasons Metsox said.
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Old 11-15-2011, 01:10 PM    (permalink
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Thank goodness. I picked up Murray in both my leagues and he's been saving my seasons.

I suddenly went from having a middle of the pack team to having a top tier team. I love me some Murray <3.

I feel tainted having Murray and McCoy on my fantasy team though.
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Old 11-15-2011, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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1) So... The S's, 3rd CB, NT, Interior Line are all needs which should be addressed before a first round backup QB.

I'm pretty unswayed by twisted words, so by saying "first round backup QB" to make it sound like drafting a 1st round QB would be anything less than getting our future franchise QB... I won't follow you there. The intent is not to spend our 1st on a back up quality QB. If you think that, then you're not looking at the long term picture, rather, you're just being shortsighted.

As for the positions you mentioned, if the value is there, then I'd be ok with drafting those too. Except Safety, I'm becoming more and more comfortable with what we've got there now, enough to erase it as a 1st round need at least (Especially when I analyze the Safety class and don't see an elite talent). I'm only keeping QB as a legitimate option and listing the reasons why I think so.


3) Completely washed up??? Are you ******* kidding me?

What I tried to convey was Romo being washed up 2/3 years down the line. Not now. I know that he could very well still be serviceable then, but honestly, I don't think he'll be a better player than he is now. ...and the Romo "now" is still very up and down. They don't call him the Romocoaster for nothing. I love the good Romo, but are the days of the bad Romo gone for good? Can't blame me for questioning that.

4) Oh **** off with this legitimate edge crap. Kitna was supposed to provide that. It's horseshit. Having a quality backup isn't going to effect Romo's game for the better or worse. You know what will... *shock horror* better playcalling.

:) Really? You think Kitna is here to put pressure on Romo? What makes you think that?

Kitna was brought in to be our backup and provide some sense of stability in case of injury and along the way provide Romo with another shoulder to lean on for veteran advice.


It's a common belief that competition will drive players to be better. Call it horseshit if you want, but I feel like Romo is in a spot that is too comfortable. Neither Kitna or McGee provides any sense of "oh no, I better play my best". Drafting a 1st or 2nd round Quarterback surely would be an indicator to him that he needs to keep his game on point. Competition is healthy and he has none right now. One of the best times for Romo was when he was proving that he was better than Bledsoe.

5) I will not deny that. It's also fantastic tradebait as Andy Reid have found out over the last few years. But having a backup to Romo now for 4-6 years down the track(cause that's how long we should be expecting him to play at a competitive level) is silly. May as well just keep McGee and have him train up the new guy 4 years down the track.

If Romo doesn't win a SB within 2-3 years, he won't have 4-6 to play as our starter.

6) It is a great point but it's completely meaningless when you acknowledge the true lack of need in drafting a QB that high.

7) By the time he gets in the starting lineup. 3/4 of the team won't be there anyway with the current turnover of NFL rosters.

His main weapons... Dez, Austin, Murray... they'll be there. I hope.

8) Tony Romo's contract WILL be reupped. Bank on that.

...I'd wait on the meltdowns to end before I believe that.

The most important thing to consider is that Romo is a long way off having a significant drop in talent. I do agree with the notion of drafting a QB before he is actually physically retired. But there is no way that date is anytime soon and we would probably have a situation where we are drafting a QB for tradebait or because this franchise is ran so poorly at times. The player would probably be cut at the end of his rookie contract and catch on elsewhere.

If and I stress IF... If a QB is atop our draft board when picking then... We should take him as I think BPA should probably be the way we go when the draft comes around. But I wouldn't be taking a QB before say a TE if a TE was #1 and a QB was #2 on the board at our selection.(this point is made to show another position of strength would still see me choose BPA against a QB)

P.S to CDCB14... I fail to see how this team has anything on it's schedule that should be referred to as a trap game. We have hardly played this season with any form of consistency or strength to think ANY game on the schedule is a given. This team is all about "Every game as it comes".
Sup shaneman. I'm glad you have a differing opinion. That's great because if everyone agreed all the time, then it'd get pretty dull around here. Not sure I get the anger, but that's ok. I like the passion.

My responses are in bold.
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Old 11-15-2011, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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Thank goodness. I picked up Murray in both my leagues and he's been saving my seasons.

I suddenly went from having a middle of the pack team to having a top tier team. I love me some Murray <3.

I feel tainted having Murray and McCoy on my fantasy team though.
That's just gotta feel greasy.

I know... cause I have Eli. LMAO.
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Old 11-15-2011, 03:39 PM    (permalink
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I watched DeMarco Murray play in a few games this year and was blown away. How did this guy last to the 3rd round of the draft?

It can't just be injuries. There's no way he looked this explosive in college and fell to the 3rd round. Adrian Peterson suffered an injury but didn't fall out of the top 10.
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Old 11-15-2011, 03:45 PM    (permalink
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I watched DeMarco Murray play in a few games this year and was blown away. How did this guy last to the 3rd round of the draft?

It can't just be injuries. There's no way he looked this explosive in college and fell to the 3rd round. Adrian Peterson suffered an injury but didn't fall out of the top 10.
I never saw the tackle breaking ability in college, but I admit I only admired him from afar. His injury prone college career also lead me to believe he was a fragile RB who was better in space than used as a thumper.
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Old 11-15-2011, 05:05 PM    (permalink
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I never saw the tackle breaking ability in college, but I admit I only admired him from afar. His injury prone college career also lead me to believe he was a fragile RB who was better in space than used as a thumper.
Was he really that injury prone? I mean a guy that keeps getting labeled injury prone he didn't miss all that much time in college while breaking Oklahoma school records.
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Old 11-15-2011, 05:25 PM    (permalink
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I never saw the tackle breaking ability in college, but I admit I only admired him from afar. His injury prone college career also lead me to believe he was a fragile RB who was better in space than used as a thumper.
Pocketaces would know being that Sooner Boomer man. Ask him.
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Old 11-15-2011, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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As a freshman he suffered a dislocated kneecap late in the year that carried over into his sophomore year. He played the whole year as a sophomore but got hurt in the big 12 championship game and did not play in the bowl game. His YPC went down from 6 to 4.3 so most people believe he lost his explosiveness. As a SR however he had over 350 touches and looked great!

If Im not mistaken, over the course of his OU career, he missed all of 2 games.

I think the injury prone tag might be a little harsh
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Old 11-15-2011, 06:10 PM    (permalink
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As a freshman he suffered a dislocated kneecap late in the year that carried over into his sophomore year. He played the whole year as a sophomore but got hurt in the big 12 championship game and did not play in the bowl game. His YPC went down from 6 to 4.3 so most people believe he lost his explosiveness. As a SR however he had over 350 touches and looked great!

If Im not mistaken, over the course of his OU career, he missed all of 2 games.

I think the injury prone tag might be a little harsh
Guess it was just an unwarranted stigma.
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Old 11-15-2011, 06:45 PM    (permalink
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As a freshman he suffered a dislocated kneecap late in the year that carried over into his sophomore year. He played the whole year as a sophomore but got hurt in the big 12 championship game and did not play in the bowl game. His YPC went down from 6 to 4.3 so most people believe he lost his explosiveness. As a SR however he had over 350 touches and looked great!

If Im not mistaken, over the course of his OU career, he missed all of 2 games.

I think the injury prone tag might be a little harsh
It seemed like more nagging injuries then anything. I just know some of them, along with the beating he took at OU, zapped some of the explosiveness he had coming out of HS, at least IMO. Now he's still got the power, vision, cut back ability, hands, agility and all those things. Honestly I don't have any complaints about his game right now.


I'm also very excited for Felix to return. He'll never be what Demarco Murray has been for us. He can't get 20 carries and 6 catches a game. But what we can do is go back to giving him 8 carries, 4 catches type of games, and work him in from there.


I guarantee with Murray running the way he's running and defenses having no idea who to key on. Felix can break 1-2 homerun style runs per game off of 13-15 touches. He's just that type of player. We don't need to lean on him, or constantly bang him up the gut over and over either.


Once he gets back into that role, and we get that 1 big play a game where he takes a 60 yard toss or screen to the house, he'll go right back to being what we seriously need. I actually think just in that regards he's better then Demarco, and I also think he has a better short area burst.


But I hope he's 100%. I'd be using the next 3 weeks to get Felix, Jenkins, and Austin ready to go for that stretch run. There is absolutely no reason to rush any of those guys with who we play. If we can't beat them with who we have it wasn't going to matter anyway.
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Old 11-15-2011, 07:00 PM    (permalink
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People beat me to it, but Murray missed all of 3 and 1/2 games at OU. A slight drop in production during his senior season do to OU having no real passing with Bradford injured then going to the draft and the fact that running backs are a dime a dozen now led to him falling to the third round.

I remember him in the spring game when he came on campus as a freshman and thought the kid was a stud. I love it. Quality draft pick. Bout time we hit on a 3rd rounder.
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Old 11-15-2011, 07:16 PM    (permalink
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Arian Foster and Ben Tate are being touted the best RB duo in the NFL... I think they are mixing it up just right. I think Demarco and Felix can battle them for that praise if we find the right combination too.

Now we just need a nickname for them... :)

There's the usuals...

Smash and Dash... Ground 'N Pound... Thunder and Lightning... But I think we can get more creative...

I like Crash 'n Burn. Murray would definitely be Crash and Felix would be Burn. lolz.

Whatever it was... Wouldn't it be the funniest thing if we could hype it up enough for it to take? All it'd really take is for a few of you to make the sign and go to game and get on TV. lol.
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Old 11-15-2011, 07:42 PM    (permalink
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Arian Foster and Ben Tate are being touted the best RB duo in the NFL... I think they are mixing it up just right. I think Demarco and Felix can battle them for that praise if we find the right combination too.

Now we just need a nickname for them... :)

There's the usuals...

Smash and Dash... Ground 'N Pound... Thunder and Lightning... But I think we can get more creative...

I like Crash 'n Burn. Murray would definitely be Crash and Felix would be Burn. lolz.

Whatever it was... Wouldn't it be the funniest thing if we could hype it up enough for it to take? All it'd really take is for a few of you to make the sign and go to game and get on TV. lol.
How about Shake 'N Bake lol
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