New England Patriots Discussion

[nepg]

To be fair, that team (d)evolved into something much different in Carroll's tenure.

I liked Pete and always thought he got a raw deal in New England. That team kept getting so close to getting over the hump, but there was always something that came up to throw a wrench in the plans (Curtis Martin, Robert Edwards).

[FlyingElvis]

Originally Posted by descendency

Just curious, why does no one ever point out that Pete Carroll coached (for 3 years) the team Bill Parcells built? And Belichick simply managed to recover the team after 3 years of Pete Carroll?

I always see people say "Belichick won with Parcells team, not his" but by the time they won in 04 (which was considered the best team in NE - save maybe 07), it had been 8 years since Parcells had any involvement with the team... which is significantly longer than most NFL players last.

I've quite seriously never seen that said in any of these "belichick isn't great" threads.

edit: Is it embarrassment? I would be embarrassed if he coached my team too.

Because people who wish to detract from how great a coach BB is often use false logic and dishonest assessments. Mostly because there's no reasonable way to argue that he's not a great coach.

Carroll is terrible. His personnel moves suck, his drafting is worse, and his 'rah rah' **** doesn't last long in the NFL - if it even holds any weight initially. Seattle will be mired in even worse of a mess within 3 years.

[Nandoss]

Originally Posted by descendency

Just curious, why does no one ever point out that Pete Carroll coached (for 3 years) the team Bill Parcells built? And Belichick simply managed to recover the team after 3 years of Pete Carroll?

I always see people say "Belichick won with Parcells team, not his" but by the time they won in 04 (which was considered the best team in NE - save maybe 07), it had been 8 years since Parcells had any involvement with the team... which is significantly longer than most NFL players last.

I've quite seriously never seen that said in any of these "belichick isn't great" threads.

edit: Is it embarrassment? I would be embarrassed if he coached my team too.

People hate the Patriots and BB because they are always good and always winning, that hate makes them find any reason possible to demerit any of their qualities even if it doesn't make sense or isn't accurate.

Out of the players that were part of the 2001 campaign, 50 joined between 2000 and 2001, several of them barely played but that just shows how much rebuilding it took in 2000, BB's only losing season in his NE career.

As for Carroll, I think he is a great college coach and an average at best professional coach. He does well when every player sees him as a father figure and believe in him, with professionals who aren't as easy to manipulate he struggles and doesn't have the technical and tactical knowledge to make up for it.

[descendency]

Tuesday night, 8 pm EST on ESPN - "The Brady 6" will discuss the 6 Super Bowls Tom Brady will win. . . I mean the 6 QBs drafted before Tom Brady and how this motivated him to be the ultimate winner.

[descendency]

A small taste of the "Brady 6" where brady talks about how frustrating it was for him to sit there and wait to be drafted.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=632...goryid=2378529

[descendency]

I don't know if anyone was hoping the Patriots pursue Nnamdi Asomugha, but the Patriots won't.

He's represented by CAA = Tom Condon.

[Nalej]

I watched a bit of the Brady 6. Liked it.

I never actually thought Nmandi was coming over to NE so I'm fine

[BradysKnee]

Was just a pipe dream anyway.

[descendency]

Originally Posted by Nalej

I watched a bit of the Brady 6. Liked it.

I never actually thought Nmandi was coming over to NE so I'm fine

Yeah. The Brady 6 seemed good, but I think it could have been better. It seemed to lack a focus. It tried to tell 3-4 stories and didn't really tell any of them.

There were some interesting tidbits though... and a lot of "yeah, we knew he would be good back then even but just passed on him" type comments.

And yea, I only thought Nnamdi would come to NE because it's one of the few places he could be an instant starter, be on a winning team, be with a winning head coach, have a franchise QB, and have cap room to pay him, and the team has a history of taking chances on FAs at big cost (though the last one was Adalius Thomas). The only reasons I could see him wanting to go elsewhere is friends, insane money, or a personality clash with someone like Belichick.

[FlyingElvis]

Nnamdi would be wasted talent in our constant zone coverage. He be a fool to come in here and have far less chance to be the impact player he will be elsewhere, especially since he'd likely have to take a lower $$$$ figure.

[TNPatsFan]

I know I'm in a minority who feels this way (like I'm the only one in it) but I think Nnamdi is one of the most overrated players in the NFL. He had one great year a few years back and has been cashing in on it ever since.

[FlyingElvis]

I haven't seen enough to know for sure. I do know that the Raiders haven't been good enough against the run to force any QB to really test Nnamdi much.

I will agree that he's overrated based on his skill / positional value / expected payday. There's no player on the field except QBs and QBKillers worth the pay he'll get.

[Nandoss]

The Brady 6 had great production and awful storyline. They mixed everything, it didn't seem to have an objective. It looked more like a collection of things related to Brady and the 6 QBs drafted before him than a documentary. It is fun to watch but needed a better director, and the narrating was very bland.
High point though was the commentary on Giovanni Carmazzi.

[Nandoss]

Have you guys seen McGinest in NFL Network?
He looks in shape. Maybe if we don't draft a OLB we bring him back. JK

[descendency]

Originally Posted by Nandoss

The Brady 6 had great production and awful storyline. They mixed everything, it didn't seem to have an objective. It looked more like a collection of things related to Brady and the 6 QBs drafted before him than a documentary. It is fun to watch but needed a better director, and the narrating was very bland.
High point though was the commentary on Giovanni Carmazzi.

Exactly what I thought. I thought the line talking about how the 49ers had hoped to draft the next Joe Montana (with Carmazzi) was one of the better ones. Unfortunately for them, the next Joe Montana was in the draft... it just wasn't Carmazzi.

[Borat]

Originally Posted by descendency

Exactly what I thought. I thought the line talking about how the 49ers had hoped to draft the next Joe Montana (with Carmazzi) was one of the better ones. Unfortunately for them, the next Joe Montana was in the draft... it just wasn't Carmazzi.

I still haz a sad.

[Matthew Jones]

Any thoughts on the forum mock so far? Still have one pick in each of the remaining rounds (5, 6, 7.)

17. OG Mike Pouncey, Florida

28. DE Muhammad Wilkerson, Temple*

41. LB Akeem Ayers, UCLA*

51. WR Torrey Smith, Maryland*

53. FS Rahim Moore, UCLA*

112. RB Kendall Hunter, Oklahoma

[FlyingElvis]

First round was solid w/Pouncey and Wilkerson. Ok value for players that should be excellent for us, but I wasn't thrilled by it.

You played the board well through the second and turned it into an awesome draft overall. Love the moves down and then back up into the second landing Ayers / Smith / Moore. Then again to package up a bunch of 5th round picks to grab Hunter.

[Nalej]

I'm not a fan of Ayers for us. *shrug*
I think he should stay in a 43 to be honest.
I'd take Houston, Reed, Acho and Sheard before I'd settle on Ayers

[Jvig43]

I'd be content with Ayers at 41.

[BradysKnee]

Originally Posted by Nalej

I'm not a fan of Ayers for us. *shrug*
I think he should stay in a 43 to be honest.
I'd take Houston, Reed, Acho and Sheard before I'd settle on Ayers

Really?
I like Ayers. I cannot see Houston or Sheard playing 3-4 at all.
Acho is a later guy that I really like though.

[Nandoss]

Originally Posted by BradysKnee

Really?
I like Ayers. I cannot see Houston or Sheard playing 3-4 at all.
Acho is a later guy that I really like though.

Didn't Houston played some snaps as OLB?

[Nalej]

Yea, Houston was an OLB for UGA. All he did was rush the passer though. For the most part
I think Sheard is athletic enough to do it but I don't have high hopes on his coverage skills though, just his pass rushing ones

[Nandoss]

Originally Posted by Nalej

Yea, Houston was an OLB for UGA. All he did was rush the passer though. For the most part
I think Sheard is athletic enough to do it but I don't have high hopes on his coverage skills though, just his pass rushing ones

Yeah! I wasn't sure if I was thinking of someone else. Thanks for clarifying that for me.
He did only rush the passer, but do you think TBC is great dropping in coverage? Jermaine Cunningham? Ninkovich? My true worry would be if he can set the edge. Covering I believe he can be just as good as what we have, and a better rusher, and I'll take take any day.
I haven't seem Sheard, but Houston seems like a decent pass rusher to me. I'd love Miller but since that's not happening and it seem Kerrigan, Smith and Quinn will be long gone when 17 comes I'd be happy with him, but maybe at 28. I'd like to see an OL at 17 if all the top pass rushers are gone, almost any that has a first round grade except Pouncey. Don't know why, just don't like the guy.

[Jvig43]

Guyz, the draft is three days away. haha