New England Patriots Discussion - Page 234

Jvig43 · 08-11-2011, 10:00 PM

What the **** are you guys smoking when it comes to Butler. How has he looked better, he got raped all up and down the field tonight, and was nowhere in position to make a play. He is not looking better god dammit, he just got ripped a new asshole by Blain Gabbert. / end rant

proshoota25 · 08-11-2011, 10:05 PM

yeah butler was abysmal tonight. if he doesnt play better soon, hes gunna get cut

Nalej · 08-11-2011, 10:16 PM

lol @ M.Roth... I bet he's double guessing he's decision now

ElectricEye · 08-11-2011, 10:18 PM

Yeah, I don't think there's anything redeeming to Butler. Staying within the proximity was never the problem with him. It's stopping the completion without interfering that's the real issue.

I also disagree with Solder looking lost. A little finesse, sure, but I didn't see any mental errors or negative plays that fall on his shoulders. Sloppy, but effective. I'm not sure starting the year is ideal for him, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if he challenged for playing time mid-season.

ElectricEye · 08-12-2011, 12:23 AM

BB seemed particularly excited about Price in the presser;

Quote:

Taylor had some good plays, made a couple good catches. I thought that was a tough catch he made in the end zone for a touchdown. He had a couple run after catch plays down the sideline there on the hitch pattern when he broke a tackle there by the corner. But again, he's done some of those things in practice the last couple weeks, but it was good to see it happen in the game. I think he’s been very competitive in practice in training camp this year. The year has made a big difference for him.

Didn't have a whole lot to say about anything else, including Mallet and Hoyer lighting it up, but got into it a bit for him.

AntoinCD · 08-12-2011, 01:14 AM

In regards to Solder, I'd be surprised if he seen any kind of relevant playing time this year barring injury. The talent is definitely there, the athletic ability is unquestionably there. However, especially at LT, the margin for error is minimal. I think BB would definitely prefer a season of average to above average consistent play from Light over sometimes flashing greatness but also having mental and technique issues occassionally with Solder.

He's a work in progress and this is the kind of guy that short sighted people at the end of the season may think was a wasted pick. However if handled properly, and Scar is one of the best to do it, then he could be a real gem.

descendency · 08-12-2011, 06:37 AM

Condensed it down... because that was hard to read.

Positives:
Kyle Love. He may not be a starting NT, but he definitely showed some good form eating blockers, getting to the runner, and getting pressure. He's a lock to make the roster (book it)

Dane Fletcher. Here are my game notes: Tackle TFL TFL PD TFL Tackle. He absolutely opened up a hole against Jacksonville's strong OL.

Rob Ninkovich. solid LOLB play. Some good tackles and some good coverage.

Brian Hoyer. I thought he executed the offense quite nicely. Made good quick decisions and has a quick release. I really think if NE decides to go with 2 QBs, someone will give up a nice pick for him. He's better than Matt Cassell.

Nate Solder. After re-watching the game, I'm not sure what I saw last night but Solder was very good. His form still needs work but he's a guy who could see significant time this season.

Stevan Ridley. If you don't know the name, you might want to learn it. He had good power, wiggle, shiftiness, and was effective bouncing out as well as pounding the ball. The announcers kept talking about his legs and pad level, but I was less impressed. Still, he's a top 3 player from the night.

Taylor Price. If the ball was in his area, he caught it and proceeded to burn you. Jacksonville either needs a massive upgrade to their secondary or Taylor Price is ready to destroy the NFL. Top 3 performer.

Aaron Hernandez. Please stop dropping the ball. He was a CIT monster. He was a YAC monster. If he could hold onto the ball, he'd be one of the biggest missmatches in the NFL.

Matthew Slater. Made an excellent catch and made a great ST tackle. If only he'd develop more as a WR.

Ryan Mallett. Wow. There were times where he made plays that a season vet would make and there were times where he would over throw people. Let's just say I've never been unimpressed by his on field performance (though, his mid range accuracy is garbage). Ryan Mallett is easily the best 3rd QB in the NFL. The one play that sticks out in my mind was Darnell Jenkins drop but Mallett rolled out of the pocked, avoided the sack, and threw a strike on the run to the back line of the endzone. If Jenkins catches it, it's a top play on Sports Center.

Meh:
Eric Moore. This is kind of harsh, but he didn't really do much. When he did it was impressive, but he was lost most of the time.

Mark Anderson. Had some good pressure. I want to see more of him with the real first team. Seemed like he could have done more though.

Danny Woodhead. Wasn't really a very good night for him. He did have a fumble, but his running wasn't very good.

Steve Maneri. I was going to put him in the negatives, but he had some good plays. I doubt he makes the team, but he has good run blocking abilities. His pass blocking is atrocious, though. He was ran over every time he had to block for Mallett.

Richard Medlin. He was effective running the ball after the starters went out. Something tells me he will make an NFL roster somewhere, but probably not here. He went to college with my dad (don't think they knew each other, but same school and same years).

Will Yeatman. Had a good game with good blocks and good CIT. However, he may be a 4th TE in a 3 TE (max) league.

Negatives:
Darius Butler. God... what did I see live that made me think he had a good game? Number 28 was constantly abused.

Darryl Richard. He lost contain a bunch. Was overall very shaky at best. Had a few good moments at the end.

Jermaine Cunningham. He played a wreckless 1 gap DE type game. Lost contain and missed assignments left and right. Had a sack, but Gabbert was deer in headlights.

Landon Cohen. He had some good plays later in the game against the backups, but I really get the impression he isn't cut out for the NFL. He was abused in the first half.

Matt Katula. You botched an extra point attempt snap??? Hope you didn't spend your money already.

Nalej · 08-12-2011, 07:52 AM

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to descendency again.

Don Vito · 08-12-2011, 08:02 AM

So I'm sure it's been covered already, but I just want to reiterate that Steven Ridley is a ******* boss. The OL looked great and we really are going to be able to run the ball.

-Price looked amazing
-Hernandez looked good
-Mallet looked very good for his first action
-Hoyer could start for someone
-Dane Fletcher was impressive
-Will Yeatmen caught my eye at TE, hope we can keep him on the PS
-Belichick definitely loves Buddy Farnham

-Mark Anderson gave up on some plays
-The secondary did not look very good

Overall it was very impressive for a preseason game. There will be a few tough cuts, thats for sure.

nepg · 08-12-2011, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElectricEye

I might buy Edelmen being more valuable two years from now...but Welker still brings a tremendous amount of value and production to the team and we have a chance to win a Super Bowl.

Edelman didn't get much playing time last year, and it didn't make sense.

Everytime he was in the game, he was the hardest working guy on the field. He's aggressive and brings a ton of energy to the offense.

I think he's better than Welker at this point. They play the same position, but Edelman is bigger, faster, more athletic, and just goes through every play like it actually matters.

Nalej · 08-12-2011, 08:34 AM

haha... you make me laugh

JHL6719 · 08-12-2011, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by descendency

I only got to see the 1st half and the 4th quarter.

Reactions:

Darius Butler is getting better but still has no clue how to actually stop a pass from being completed.

Dane Fletcher has definitely played his way onto the roster. Can we invent a D with 3 ILBs and use Mayo + Spikes + Fletcher?

Aaron Hernandez looked good when he wasn't putting the ball on the ground.

Brian Hoyer looked sharp against Jacksonville's 1st team defense.

Taylor Price caught a behind the back throw for a TD. He's also played his way onto the team.

After starting slow, the DL picked it up.

Stevan Ridley was a better BJGE (definitely a nice supplement to BJGE if nothing else). Ridley has a little wiggle which lets him get outside.

Was a pretty good game from Matthew Slater. I wish he'd show up like that more often.

Still worried about Solder. He looks like he needs to ride the bench this year. Looked lost at times.

If we were only keeping 2 QBs, Ryan Mallett definitely made the case for him to be #2.

Did I mention Dane Fletcher? I think he just had another TFL.

What did I miss?

Are the Pats considering only keeping 2 QB's?

Nalej · 08-12-2011, 08:36 AM

I really think we keep all 3 QBs but we'll see.

SolidGold · 08-12-2011, 08:57 AM

Kudos to the Pats coaching staff. I know it was one preseason game but Hoyer and Mallet both looked very good. Hoyer was also good last preseason. It seems that they know how to develop QBs. It was also great seeing Mallet perform well after being dragged through the mud during the predraft process and lasting all the way until the third round when he is actually the most pro ready QB in this year's draft class. I think its safe to say he has the strongest arm in the NFL, he needs to learn to throw with a little touch but I love seeing him sling it.

descendency · 08-12-2011, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHL6719

Are the Pats considering only keeping 2 QB's?

Some people keep rumoring it. I really doubt it unless someone calls them and offers a high pick for Hoyer.

nepg · 08-12-2011, 09:28 AM

I don't see them carrying more than 2. They haven't for years and really need the roster space. Mallett seems ready, so why not deal Hoyer?

ElectricEye · 08-12-2011, 10:00 AM

If someone gives up a draft pick for Hoyer I would be totally for it. It would have to be at least a third round pick though.

nepg · 08-12-2011, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElectricEye

If someone gives up a draft pick for Hoyer I would be totally for it. It would have to be at least a third round pick though.

I could see them doing it for a 4th or 5th with some clauses.

ElectricEye · 08-12-2011, 10:12 AM

Yeah, a conditional performance based one would be cool. I really haven't taken a look at teams that would bite. I guess Washington could be one off the top of my head, but they might be convinced that it's Sexy Rexy and Stormin Mormon time.

But yeah, listening to the radio a bit today. Big fan outcry for Fletcher to play, but the talking heads aren't buying it. I really think he can play quite a bit on defense this year. Spikes was pretty up and down last season, and looked to have a ceiling of a two down thumper anyway. Fletcher on passing downs and inside on 4-3(with Mayo going outside) would be the way I would do it personally. I really think you've got to get this guy on the field though. He looked like Teddy last night, barking out plays, shooting gaps, and faking the blitz.

BradysKnee · 08-12-2011, 10:35 AM

Hoyer is a very good quarterback, I really think he'd be a top 15 QB starting somewhere after some time.

I wouldn't trade him for less than a high 2nd.

SolidGold · 08-12-2011, 11:06 AM

I just find it pretty astonishing that some teams are able to find diamonds in the rough as late round picks or UDFAs at QB and really coach them up and develop them while other teams are so inept at identifying and developing QBs even if they are early round picks.

New England and Green Bay seem to really just have a culture instilled that allows for them to develop QBs but also have the scouting talent to be able to ID guys that have potential in this league that are bypassed by everyone else.

proshoota25 · 08-12-2011, 12:36 PM

very interesting note that i read in mike reiss' blog last night:

Pat Chung played FS

Meriweather played SS

proshoota25 · 08-12-2011, 12:38 PM

i honestly dont think a team this year will go out and trade for hoyer to be a starting QB. i think he needs to get some regular season action before any team does give up an asset like a high draft pick. this had to happen before kolb, cassel, schaub were all traded

nepg · 08-12-2011, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradysKnee

Hoyer is a very good quarterback, I really think he'd be a top 15 QB starting somewhere after some time.

I wouldn't trade him for less than a high 2nd.

I wouldn't go that far...but he could potentially start for a few teams. I wouldn't expect more than a 3rd (at the very best) in return for Hoyer. I'd be happy to see him get a chance and to free up a roster spot.

Bengals, Seahawks, Redskins, Raiders, Dolphins, and Bills.

proshoota25 · 08-12-2011, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nepg

I wouldn't go that far...but he could potentially start for a few teams. I wouldn't expect more than a 3rd (at the very best) in return for Hoyer. I'd be happy to see him get a chance and to free up a roster spot.

Bengals, Seahawks, Redskins, Raiders, Dolphins, and Bills.

and you can cross off the dolphins and bills for trades