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Old 01-24-2012, 11:24 AM    (permalink
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I disagree there. I thought that offensive line was among the more overrated units I've seen since watching football. I seem to remember Jay and I getting with fights with people about our line being amazing back in the day. I won't get into that too too much, but I wasn't really all that surprised when they couldn't block those Giants linemen worth a damn when it got down to it.

I feel much better about this unit with Light playing pretty good football and the addition of Brian Waters. Waters is at least as good as Stephen Neal was for us, possibly better. Solder is far better than Nick Kaczur ever was already, even if he's the weakest length in the chain right now. If we can get Vollmer back to help out, even better. The only position I think is in question is center. I would still take Koppen over Connolly, but Connolly might be a little more stout against bigger guys.
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Old 01-24-2012, 11:33 AM    (permalink
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This Oline is certainly more talented. Between Dante and Brady, our Olines tend to gel very well and that makes a huge difference. The 2007 line had a much better run with consistency and that covered up for some average talent. I think Kazcur, Neal & Koppen were much easier to exploit physically (both power and scheme) than Solder, Waters and any C we trot out with them.
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Old 01-24-2012, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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I'm skeptical about Solder, he was letting the majority of the pressure through against the Ravens, a few times just letting a guy run in without being touched.
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Old 01-24-2012, 11:45 AM    (permalink
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The only time I really saw him get beat horribly was that move Kruger put on him. He's still learning to play the position and by no means am I saying he's an All-Pro...but I would take him over Kaczur for sure. I think people forget just how rough stuff could get with him at times. The rest of the talent on offense sort of covered up some of the deficient parts of that group, but in a vacuum I'm taking these guys.
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Old 01-24-2012, 12:07 PM    (permalink
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Terrell Suggs burned him a few times. Suggs gave up coming off the left for a long stretch, because he was basically eating Solder's lunch.
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Old 01-24-2012, 12:40 PM    (permalink
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Terrell Suggs burned him a few times. Suggs gave up coming off the left for a long stretch, because he was basically eating Solder's lunch.
They started having Gronk chip (to huge success) to help Solder and it paid huge dividends.
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Old 01-24-2012, 12:59 PM    (permalink
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If Vollmer can play next week it would be great to get him back and having Solder as an extra TE to help against the rush as well. I think the key factor to this game for however comes down to whether or not Gronk is healthy and ready to go. I'm very concerned about his health, even if he does play idk if he's going to be the Gronk weve watched all year.
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Old 01-24-2012, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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I agree that having Vollmer back could be huge for us as it would allow us to use Solder as a TE that can either stay and block or chip. I'm sure we'll try and target him as well.. However, Vollmer has had some issues this year with speedy rushers dipping their shoulders. It's as if he couldn't reach them because he couldn't twist his back or... Well, I don't know how to explain it properly. It just didn't look like he was comfortable. If this is still the case I'm extremely worried about having him in there. When healthy he's a beast, but that back injury seems pretty serious.. I'm still scared shitless about this game.
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Old 01-24-2012, 01:39 PM    (permalink
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I'm certainly not betting on Vollmer playing at this point. Back injuries are absolutely devastating for linemen. I said it when it happened, but it's possible he might not be the same guy ever again unfortunately. It's a huge, huge problem going forward and more importantly, going into this game. Can't know for sure though. He's been practicing for two weeks now and has another two to get ready, so you never know. Getting him to play as part of a rotation could be a good way to use him.

But I'm really not all that concerned with Solder. He didn't play his best football the other day, but we've seen him play better multiple times throughout the year. You want to have your best players out on the field in a game like this, but I really feel like we can get by with Solder.
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Old 01-24-2012, 01:51 PM    (permalink
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I'm not concerned with Solder either. I think he's going to be a premier tackle in the NFL on the left side. He's just that athletic. I can't wait for us to show Light the door even though he's been playing very well this year.
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Old 01-24-2012, 02:45 PM    (permalink
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Just saw this on NE's FB page:


Pretty cool....
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:01 PM    (permalink
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My work with New England in the forum mock is done!

40. CB Chase Minnifield, Virginia

46. DT Brandon Thompson, Clemson

49. DE Andre Branch, Clemson

78. WR Jeff Fuller, Texas A&M

83. C Ben Jones, Georgia

111. SS Harrison Smith, Notre Dame

183. QB Chandler Harnish, Northern Illinois

189. WR Devon Wylie, Fresno St.

Also acquired a 2013 first-round pick from Dallas for the #51 overall pick and traded Brian Hoyer to Miami for the #183 overall pick (QB Chandler Harnish), a 2013 third-round pick, and a 2013 sixth-round pick.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:04 PM    (permalink
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I like Smith and Wylie in those spots. Smith especially, great value there. He wouldn't be the answer for our safety woes, but we need someone to spell Chung for the four weeks plus weeks he's hurt a year.

...I actually wouldn't be surprised if Smith ended up being a better player than Chung. I'm not trying to knock Chung any, but Smith is surprisingly sure in coverage even though he'll allow some completions. Very disciplined player.

I think Wylie has been a little overhyped as a guy everyone wants to look like a genius on, but he's got a good combination of speed and quickness and would add some real return value to the team, something we lack right now in a major way.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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You go and you get Brain Hoyer back RIGHT NOW!
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:34 PM    (permalink
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Drafting a quarterback is so much more fun though. It will be interesting to see what happens with Hoyer and Mallet. I really feel like Hoyer could start for some teams(although I'm not sure how good he would be). It's a shame we didn't get into more blowouts on the year/have a meaningless game to help his stock the way that Matt Flynn did. I'm not sure how realistic it is for us to get anything substantial for him the way things stand. I don't even want to think about restricted free agent hoopla right now haha. It's possible that we could get an extra third rounder for him.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:39 PM    (permalink
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lol

Yeah, I love the guy, but with Mallet in the fold it's tough to see any real long term value for Hoyer. I suppose it's safe to say no news is good news as far as Mallet is concerned. At least he didn't pull a Len Bias on us.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:45 PM    (permalink
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I still just don't like the guy. He just comes off like a major douche from everything I've read about him/every time I've seen him interviewed. Not the kind of guy I want leading my franchise into the future. But we'll have to see how that situation pans out. Maybe he was severely humbled by the draft going the way it did. Maybe we trade him to someone who doesn't find a quarterback in the draft for something. Who knows? It has been amazingly quiet on his front this year though, even by Patriots rookie standards.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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I agree it's great to have a reasonably humble guy and he seemed a bit douchey. But being a young, cocky, all-world talent can cause a kid to get a bit inflated. Nothing that can't be brought in check, especially with a draft day slide and some time in a BB environment. We'll see what kind of asset he is over time. The talent alone makes me want to see him stay but it's all going to come down to his final contract year vs. Brady's status of decline.
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Old 01-24-2012, 06:22 PM    (permalink
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Interesting stats from the last game:

We lost 4 turnovers.
Giants lost 2.

Our Penalties - 7-81
Giants - 6-50

We missed a FG.

We had alot of injuries: Mayo/Hern/Welker were all hurting. Shaun Ellis was inactive.

Giants were missing Hakeem Nicks, Prince Amukamara, David Baas.

We only rushed 19 times to a RB.
Tom Brady threw 49 times.

All in all I feel this is going to be a /very/ different game than the last one. I think both teams are going to try to run on us more. I can't see NYG doing it if Baltimore couldn't and our rushing attack might be key to winning.

We also had 0 sacks. Played insanely conservatively. Cannot do that again IMO.

Brady was sacked twice but pressure wasn't as bad as I initially remembered
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:15 PM    (permalink
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I can see a lot of running in this game on both sides, also Gmen didnt have Bradshaw, by a lot I meant near 25 rushes each.

Where does Edleman figure on D? He got torched by a slow, smarter Wr like Boldin. I'd rather have McCourty, Arrington, Molden out there who can at least go stride for stride with Manningham.

The interior of Giants line is a weakness. Vince only lined up at NT like 19 times last game in 67 snaps. Some number like that. I wonder if he sees more time inside.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:21 PM    (permalink
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I can deal with Edelman at defensive back if we don't try to throw to him anymore. We've been trying to get him more involved in the offense in the playoffs and it's just not cutting it. He actually does a pretty decent job covering smaller players and backs on the inside routes.

Molden could be important. He's been inconsistent on the year, but he's flashed the ability to play the deep ball really well in spots. I'm actually pretty surprised we haven't stuck him at safety yet. When he's running towards the ball and playing the deep zone, he's really good. When he's in the back pedal he loses track of people and is beaten easily on inside moves.
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:22 PM    (permalink
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This game is a match up heaven the more I think about it. Webster, Ross, Prince, Kenny, Rolle are a solid secondary. No one is really a liability. The Ravens kept the middle of the field open and a lot of the Pats success was under neath on crossing routes which freed up Welker, Hern and Gronk to rely on their YAC abilities. I don't know if the Giants will do a good job open field tacking like the Ravens? Does anyone know how they are in that facet? Giving up YAC to the Pats is what kills a team. You can try to play tight and have LBs and safeties play closer to middle...then BOOM run action deep out to Hern one on one with an LB or a safety who bit on the run action and is a step or two late.

The offensive line is overrated talent wise but as a unit they are coached so well by DS. They are so good at selling a run that cause those LBs and Safeties to bite for that one second.

If Gronk is hobbled, do you think they run some Cannon at that 3rd receiving eligible OT to keep that pass rush at bay? This is all pends on Vollmer since Solder is a beast at that 3rd OT spot.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:27 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bored of education View Post
This game is a match up heaven the more I think about it. Webster, Ross, Prince, Kenny, Rolle are a solid secondary. No one is really a liability. The Ravens kept the middle of the field open and a lot of the Pats success was under neath on crossing routes which freed up Welker, Hern and Gronk to rely on their YAC abilities. I don't know if the Giants will do a good job open field tacking like the Ravens? Does anyone know how they are in that facet? Giving up YAC to the Pats is what kills a team. You can try to play tight and have LBs and safeties play closer to middle...then BOOM run action deep out to Hern one on one with an LB or a safety who bit on the run action and is a step or two late.

The offensive line is overrated talent wise but as a unit they are coached so well by DS. They are so good at selling a run that cause those LBs and Safeties to bite for that one second.

If Gronk is hobbled, do you think they run some Cannon at that 3rd receiving eligible OT to keep that pass rush at bay? This is all pends on Vollmer since Solder is a beast at that 3rd OT spot.
It is absolutely all about the matchups. I think Welker Gronk and Hern all have advantages offensively. As do the Giants WRs of course lol.

I think the key for us defensively will be interior pressure from Mayo Wilfork Love and Spikes. I think the Giants Interior OL is weak and can be exposed.

I think Solder is more likely to the 3rd TE role if Vollmer is healthy, otherwise it is very possible. Could also see Ninkovich there lol.

Gronk is gonna be fine. He's definately sprained. I'm sure he won't be running this week at all and will be very well attended. Gametime he'll be sore a bit there but a shot of the good stuff and adrenaline will have him A-OK.
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:27 PM    (permalink
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I think the Giants are an easier draw in a lot of ways than the 49ers were with regards to run after the catch. The Giants linebackers have been much maligned all year and with good reason. If Gronk is ready to go, he and Hernandez could represent some real problems for them. They do for everyone, but especially for the Giants. We moved the ball real well on them last time but had a hard time finishing. Hernandez was still coming back from a sprained MCL too. He played, but he didn't play all that well. He actually had a real hard time with that until near the end of the season, so having him back at full strength in this one could really pay huge dividends.
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Old 01-24-2012, 07:33 PM    (permalink
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I think YAC will be the biggest reason for a team winning or losing. Look at the YAC monsters on The Giants in Nicks and Cruz. The Pats lead the world in YAC this year, 45% of passing yards for Brady this year were YAC.

YAC equals third down conversions, momentum swingers, 50 yards TDs.

The media seems to be focused on which QB will stay up right, which is true for every game ever. But containing those catching the ball and what they do after they catch it will be as important as ever.


Lets estimate 25 completions for each team. Average of 2 yards after catch compared to 6 yards is a 100 yard difference. Those extra hundred yards can win the game.

Oh man am I over analyzing again?
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<+BOE> Scott, with Burfict's character concerns (whether legit or not) you think Pioli would draft him. :D
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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